- Have any questions?
- +61 383 766 284
- [email protected]
The Advaita Show #019 – Guest Starring Steven
The Advaita Show #018 – Compassion
January 10, 2006The Advaita Show #020 – Disaster Strikes!
January 24, 2006The Advaita Show #019 (MP3 – 14MB – 39min)
Steven visits us from Carmel, California today and we do the usual schtick. Not many question from you last week, which we’re hoping means you’ve given up on this whole seeking rubbish and gone back to whatever it was you were doing before…. now we can get on with our lives… oh make sure you do tune in this week to hear more than you ever wanted about the guru’s sexual proclivities… and make sure you come back next week when we MIGHT (I havent decided yet) turn this into a video podcast…
Podcast: Play in new window | Download
33 Comments
Cameron and Bob –
Love the show, I’ve listened to every podcast from the first, don’t ever stop (Wish Allin Taylor hadn’t, I really miss her I was waiting for her to interview Cameron on his next US Visit! Not enough girl’s in Advaita by the way).
Saturday I listened to shows 1 thru 10 again, all afternoon – hey it was a slow day.
But anyway, I’ve been thinking about the comment a couple of shows back about talking to your kid’s about Advaita, and it got me thinking. Cameron commented that his kids at 5 are too young and I agree; however I’m coming to think that 12 is about the right age to be introduced to Advaita. My son happens to be 12, and I can’t get over how needless of everything he is (especially of my wife and me).
A good example is the other day when he’s describing a Sponge Bob episode (the ultimate Advaita cartoon, forget about the Lion King, Ravi). So, Sponge Bob is transporting into another dimension, but instead of being the past or the future it’s Nowhere. And he’s going on about how great this is; I’m finally alone at last, alone at last, and it’s echoing on and on, from a million directions “alone at last…†and I’m thinking, oh it’s Indra’s net. And Alex is laughing himself silly trying to imagine; the thought of ever being alone. Ah, to be twelve again…
Most Avaita song ever, On a Clear Day, (you can see Forever) Barbra Streisand.
Cameron, if you’re ever in Cleveland and you don’t stop by I’ll never forgive you.
Until then ‘Sponge Bob and Squidwerd’, our thoughts are with you.
Love Ya,
Doug the Slug from Cleveland
Hi Cameron and Bob—
I’m running out of questions to ask every week, so I guess this stuff is sinking in….maybe these will be my last…
1. What can you say about bizarre coincidences/ psychic flashes/ and serendipity? What exactly is happening in those moments? And do you believe they are ‘meaningful’ as some new age gurus suggest? Meant to guide us toward enlightenment?
2. I still am not understanding how we, as the unique individual “patterns” that we are, don’t have free will. After all, didn’t God give us free will to choose him or not? I understand that “I” don’t beat my own heart, and that I can’t create my own thoughts, but I do feel I have the freedom to choose whether or not I ACT on certain thoughts. Isn’t that free will?
Hi guys!!!
I’ve always had 2 main problems with Advaita
1. Personal doership – That wall is gradually breaking down, thanks to your shows, the internet, several books and a bit of experimenting.
2. The other important point is trying to integrate more traditional spiritual teachings eg. meditation etc. with Advaita
Here’s an interesting passage I read recently “ Many people want to practice non-dualistic meditation… after reading a few books on Advaita. Most of them give up after a short while. … for a few others it may take several months or even years of futile effort to understand that non-dualism is beyond their grasp. … non-dualism is a state of actual experience. …so long as there is meditation and the object of meditation even in the subtlest form, it is dualism. For most people it may even take millions of years to attain to that [non-dualistic] state.â€
From the book “ Meditation and Spiritual Lifeâ€
Swami Yatiswarananda, Ramakrishna Math
My understanding is that the Neo-Advaita that is spoken of here is different from the traditional Advaita [Jnana (gyan) Yoga] and for that matter Zen Buddhism, because the latter imply “pathsâ€. Correct???
But can one really attain the realization by just being??? A lot of Spiritual teachers, although aware of and practice Advaitic understanding, preach dualistic practices simply because the vast majority of the masses are just not ready for it.
I know all arguments and discussions can only be in duality but can the traditional practices help in self-realisation???
I guess my second problem is just an anti-thesis to the first. So, I’m really going around in circles. ïŠ
Regards
ravi
———————————————————————————————————————————
Cameron I’d like to thank you for bringing yourself and Bob to a seeker like myself
who has no chance of seeing you guys in the flesh, I’m poor , dialup connection poor,6 year old computer poor. Anywho the question I’d like to ask is about nonconceptual awareness. On a cd I have of Bob’s he sez that he looks at his body
the same as a chair or something like that. I was wondering Cameron if that’s the way
you see things before the mind comes up and starts labeling? Is there a space between those two things? Bob do you ever just stay in the nonconceptual for a time when there’s nothing to occupy your mind?
Also I’d like to know if after you knew what you really were ,did that sense arise from
a different place in the body than before? P.S I’d like to thank Steven for his insights.
Doug – funnily enough, the other day, after driving Steven to his new hotel, after we recorded this episode, one of my sons says to me, from the backseat
“So, Dad, did you have a good meeting with Bob?”
I said “yes I did thank you”. He then asks “so, what did you talk about?” I replied “well we were talking about advaita”. He says “what’s that?”. I reply “well it’s something adults with too much time on their hands sometimes talk about.” He then asks “well can you explain it to me?” I start to explain it to him but get no further than “well it’s a way of thinking about who we are and how we fit into the universe” when he interrupts me with “what’s for lunch?”
Ah my son, you *are* wise….
Dan, the body is a body and the chair is a chair and if anyone ever tells you different, sit on their head and see how long it is before they change their mind.
That was very funny Cameron.
Enjoyed the show and thought Steven made some very useful contributions.
In my own case there is some recognition of the lack of a separate self. What is less clear is how there is no duality. Is this simply what remains when we realise there is no independent self ? It is often presented as something far grander. I remember one teacher stating that at the point of realisation he felt he *was* the stove, wall etc. This sounds very expansive and extraordinary and quite beyond what appears to me presently.
best
Glenn
Howdy. In addition to thanking Bob & Cameron for their insights, thanks Steven for your friendly recommendations.
Doug, Be cautious in mentioning Sponge Bob since the extreme right considers him to be as gay as the Teletubbies. Beware-Bush might tap your phones.
Ravi, Ranjit Maharaj recommended meditation. Many advaitists say it doesn’t matter because there is no one to meditate. One type, which I think fits, was recommended by a Tibetan Buddhist I saw, who said to meditate by relaxing without conception or reference point.
dan… about the chair…. for me, “chair” is just a mental concept, a label. That “thing” over there (reaches out and touches it) can never be captured with the concept “chair”. If I see it as a “chair” I miss its shape, its texture, the incredible patterns in the wood, the way it supports the body…. Without the concept “chair”, it’s an astounding mystery. But we say “chair” for simplicity! The reality is, it’s not a chair. For purely practical purposes, it’s a chair! It’s a chair – it’s not a chair. Words will never capture it!
cameron…. i love what you said about your son… my girlfriend is the same… as soon as i start babbling on about present awareness, seeing through the mind, etc, etc, she’ll ask about last night’s television! So refreshing. There is NOTHING that is not “spiritual”. Watching tv, stuck in a traffic jam, in the line for the bank…. present awareness shines wherever you are.
glenn…. in reality, you are the stove already …..
next time you look at a stove, find out what comes between you and the stove…. you look, and you see that thing over there, and the thought “stove” pops up, along with the conceptual thought structure to support that. those thoughts are from the past, they are knowledge…… when thought dissolves, there is no “you” and no “stove”, as these are no longer seperated by a wall of thought. there is only awareness shining brightly, and that thing you call “stove” is a welcome guest in awareness – except with no concept of “stove” you have no idea what you’re looking at! try it with a stove. in the present moment, can you be there with the stove without any concept of what it is? of course, words don’t capture it at all…..
it’s like when you look into the eyes of a loved one and all time and space disappears, and there is ONLY that moment. try it with a stove. see if you can love a stove that much too! you can – and that’s the miracle of presence-awareness…..
Jeff and Cameron – You guy’s both touched on it; I guess it just seems (to me) to be most amplified in the 12 year old pre-adolescent male. It’s what my wife calls, the “Space Gene†as in, from the Star Trek intro – “Space…the Final Frontierâ€. It is the natural ability to simply drop (what you considered) the current line of thought for another (what they consider) an equally valid one. I’ve been guilty of this since pre-school (50 years ago), my wife being a child psychologist is very familiar with the trait (me). She’s convinced it runs in families, I have not been so sure, but who knows. I myself, see it as 50% physical (DNA) and 50% Environmental (Input), but both handed down Father to Son. Another reason there isn’t that many females involved in Advaita. At the very least, it is a blessing and not a curse, of that I’m sure! But could it be a Survival Strategy?
Thanks for your reply to my query about the chair, cameron, you know
how to cut through the shit and make me laugh at the same time.
Thanks also for the podcast network, it’s given me a chance to hear people I’ve
only read about .
Greatfully and that’s no shit dan
Dan, thanks for the compliment on TPN. I’m having the time of my life and hope that we can re-define the kinds of media people listen to, watch and read over the next few years. I saw “Good Night and Good Luck” tonight and Murrow’s comments towards the end of the film (about whether or not TV can be intelligent and probing or just entertainment for the masses) struck me as also very true about podcasting. Viva la Revolution!
Great show guys, thanks for doing this. I can’t stop listening to them.
My question is about the difference between ‘subjective reality’ and ‘objective reality’.
We live in our private, subjective worlds. Each of our brains interpret reality through the five main senses and thoughts. What we see is the image that the eyes and brain have made for us, we are not directly seeing reality. The same is true for the rest of the senses. We each live in our own ‘representative reality’, created by our nervous system. In this representative reality, everything is made of awareness. There are no independent objects there.
In objective reality, nothing ‘looks’ a certain way, there is no time, no space, no objects, no image, no sound, no feel. All there is in reality is just energy and its patterns (whatever ‘energy’ is).
I can only say that everything in my private, representative reality is made of awareness. Most scientists would say that awareness – whatever that is – is also generated by the brain. How do I know that everything in ‘objective reality’ is also awareness?
Thanks for answering my question the other week .
you were saying how life goes on much the same after this is “seen”,
but what about the separate self sense , is it still around in the same way as before;
planning things , choosing things , acting in it’s own interests.. but not taken seriously
or is it simply absent and things just happen?
Hi Cameron! Hi Bob!
Love the show. Steven had some great comments, too.
A question, sort of:
Is it more true to say that the body-mind is an appearance in pre-existing, eternal awareness, rather than that awareness is an emergent property of the body-mind, that completely comes and goes with the body-mind?
Or are both statements basically just concepts, equally irrelevant?
Anyway, it reminds me of a Copernican Revolution, of sorts, where instead realizing that it is the earth that revolves around the sun and not the the sun revolving around the earth, we similarly may realize that it is the body that revolves around this unmoving awareness, rather than awareness being a property or possession of the body.
If it’s true, then somebody should let the neuroscience community in on this.
Just a thought.
Cheers,
Ken in Ohio
Hello
Is there similarity between Advaita (no free will, no separate entity controling life) and spirituality of Australian aboriginal people, indians and other past traditions?
There is nothing we can do as there was nothing they could do – in their lives, not even to stop the “invasion of white people”, “kaliyuga” or whatever.
How interesting or more varied questions do you want Cameron? Be glad that there is noone asking anything, as it is so, even if someone asks something.
🙂
michal
Excellent show, guys! It’s really hard to find people with whom you can just sit around and discuss this type of thing with, but with your show, it’s almost just like I’m there in Bob’s livingroom taking part in the conversation.
At any rate, I was just jammin’ on the iPod when a song by Joe Walsh popped up, and so I thought I’d post the lyrics…
Life Of Illusion Lyrics
Sometimes I can’t help feeling that I’m
Living a life of illusion
And oh, why can’t we let it be
And see through the hole in this wall of confusion
I just can’t help the feeling I’m
Living a life of illusion
Pow, right between the eyes
Oh, how nature loves her little surprises
Wow, it all seems so logical now
It’s just one of her better disguises
And it comes with no warning
Nature loves her little surprises
Continual crisis
Hey, don’t you know it’s a waste of your day
Caught up in endless solutions
That have no meaning, just another hunch
Based upon jumping conclusions
Endless solutions
Backed up against a wall of confusion
Living a life of illusion
Living a life of illusion
Living a life of illusion
(FADES)
What can we do to accept a partner who is always overwelmed by life’s circumstances or complaining about stuff to maintain her identity as Eckhart Tolle says. If it bugs me then does this mean I’m not accepting what “IS” or should I move away from the annoyance?
Hey Craig, Steven was telling me over drinks the other night that he met Joe Walsh back when he (Steven) was a bigshot businessman. He’s a big fan as well. Hmmm. Maybe we should invite Joe onto the show. Anyone got his number?
Ken, the Copernican Revolution is a good analogy. It’s just a change of perspective. So completely simple, direct and natural that it’s quite amusing the whole edifice we build around it during the journey.
Pow, right between the eyes
Oh, how nature loves her little surprises
My favorite line.
Elvis and Fester, I am here on Waiheke Island sat-chitting with Ananda!
Non-dual speak aside, I miss you guys.
Thanks to you both so much and Big love.
Send a big hug to Barb as well.
What a week down under! Nothing doesn’t get any better.
She’ll be right mate.
Steven, I always prefer to sit while i shat, so I know the feeling. If you meet Ananda on the road, duck. Great spending time with you, come back soon. I think I might change the name of the show to “no worries mate”, whaddya think?
Cameron,
Maybe you should get Joe on the show… Steven could call him up and have him do a short “guest appearance” via phone!
“No worries, Mate!” show sounds grrrrreat!
Cameron, you are on to something. Enough of the non-duality lingo dingo- bark!
Steven, enjoyed your sharing…give us ringy in San Fran if ya like
Hug to Bob, yo, Daddy-O! The Beat poets can never match your prose of consciousness, man! A toast of frothy capuccino to ya!
Hi Camerobob,
no question but an item that I think may be worth discussing since there is (not on this show but all over the place) much misunderstanding on this particular one.
As brilliantly noted in the anology “Copernican Revolution Thingy”. It is just a matter of dropping a faulty assumption. The interesting and suprising part is that this assumption is dropped by no-one but “the ONE”.
There is sometimes the misconception that then, the identities would cease to exist and dissapear and that Cameron, Bob, Steve, Tan would cease to exist. no, nada, ie, nein.
Cameron-ing, Bob-ing Steve-ing are still happening but it is evident that they are happening similarly as drinking, eating, farting, are happening. (they appear as a variant of thinking and feeling, so thinking with a cherry flavor). No One is doing the Cameron-ing and steve-ing. This can be easily seen when there is awareness of what is happening:
For instance when farting is happening, cameron-ing is not happening for a second and then cameon-ing is happening again , then there is drink-ing happing and some order-ing or maybe think-ing about the blonde hot waitress and for while cameron-ing stops and later continues and so on and so on …
so there are all this beautifully unique “personas” still happening but no-one is doing them.
Cheers
p.s.
Disclaimer: Since I have no DSL connection anymore I do not listen to the show anymore currently. This message may be a boring repitition of a discussion you guys had in shows 14-19. But I guess that should be fine since actually all stuff on the show is a repitition of: There is only ONE or No-one, or the “doughnut” or “THAT” …. bye
Hi Bob And Cameron
Recently i read about a absolutely merciless killing here in the UK.
I wondered what is the non-dual take on this heavy stuff.
Thanks again for the Show.
Steve P
Cameron & Bob:
Great show
Question? – What would Bob say is the signifigance of the crucifiction of Christ?
I had all that stuff shoved down my throat for 20 years and was just wondering how Bob sees it
Thanks
Hi guys! “rich†here from michigan usa. Been a listener since show # ONE.
Could bob offer a consideration on the following?
The personna rich called “wifeâ€, whose bod/min ceased manifestation 2 years ago, had a first husband who had been dead 20 years. When she told me his spirit occasionally visited her, i thought “yeah… rightâ€, and forgot about it.
Early in our courting, when she was spending the night, i awoke from a deep sleep to find a man at the foot of the bed. Without thinking, the fight response kicked in, adrenaline squirted though the body’s veins, and i found myself punching and flailing the air at the footboards. Totally confused, i turned when i heard diane giggling… she said she had been awake visiting with her dead ex-husband. After overcoming confusion and embarrassment, i smelled something like a dead animal. I went outside to see what it was… Yet, outdoors smelled like michigan springtime. i recalled reading that ghosts sometimes give off foul odors. Another belief happened.
So, the mind has an idea, then an experience, then a belief. With advaita teaching, the mind appears to be trying to find a loophole to guaranty it’s appearance of existing. The belief has been let go of, the event has been regarded as a riddle, better left to those who solve riddles. Is this a solvable riddle?
The reason I ask, is at no time does the mind produce the thought of questioning other beliefs that have dissolved. Occasionally, this thought, like all others arrives from nowhere, is recognized, and goes nowhere. But, this one lingers longer, with an question mark attached. Other thoughts may arrive, yet depart with a period. When i ask, who wants the riddle solved, I know there is no one. Yet, there “seems” to be an asker of questions…
Thanx in advance…
Tan all farting is resolved in the unborn buddha’s seventh planet.
Tan, no DSL??? What kind of cruel planet do you live on? If you’d like me to email a monthly summary of the shows to you on a dvd, let me know. BUt you aren’t missing much. The old bloke rabbits on, I make fun of him, of you guys, of my so-called “self”… you know. Same old schtick. 🙂
Cameron,
I live in the far far reaches of the galaxy (-50 kms off munich ) in a nowhere village that is so small that the German Telecom does not even bother to provide the people (1500 souls) living here with a broadband connection. I currently ordered DSL via Satellite and will try to install the stuff in a matter of weeks .. or?. ( but it is a shitty solution)
Thanks for the offer on the email summaries.
If I fail miserably I may take you up on your generous offer.
Many thanks
All my best to “da dj sailor” as well
cheers
p.s.
If I ever make it to Australia I would love to chat with you ( not about advaita. There is No-One and we’re Done. takes 2 secs) but about:
– podcast, the internet, and all the other happy manifestations going on.
Hope your business takes off !!
[…] We’re back! Well kinda sorta. I’m hanging out in Carmel, California with my peep Steve Witt (who was on the show back in January) and he WON’T SHUT UP ABOUT ADVAITA so I though I might as well turn the microphone on and record some of it. We’ve been laughing so hard about the whole thing it’s been a lot of fun. So there is no Bob on this show, no Eliot, nobody who is enlightened, nobody who has “the understanding”, nobody at all in fact. Just a couple of dude, sitting drinking tequila, having a laugh. […]